High Idle/ Rough engine

[6666]

Hey guys My Polo 95 TSI has been idling around 950-1000 when warmed up since October ish? I don't remember exactly what it idled at before and I was just wondering if this is normal.? Outside temp is about 8 degrees

I say this because when at a traffic light or so I can really feel vibrations through the pedals/wheels/side handle that I'm not sure if that's normal or not. it's really not heavy vibrations but not unnoticeable either.

Also the engine at idle sounds really rattly ever since I bought it but I've never owned a 3cyl before so I'm not sure if that's what they sound like

sorry this my second car I want to make sure I'm not breaking it cheers lads

[Harrihealey02]

All 3 cylinder cars will have more of a rough idle than 4 cylinder ones. The sound is pretty normal as my friend has the 3 cylinder 1.0 model from 2018. Sounds like a high pitch tapping noise but it’s the direct injection fuel that’s making that noise. I would imagine in this cold temperature the engine will idle higher to compensate for extra load on the battery i.e lights, heater fan and also to keep the engine at a good temperature for GPF. After a long motorway drive the idle should decrease compared to when it was cold but if not there may be a pending issue.

[silverhairs]

Reading your post, you don't mention if it's a new Polo or a second hand, if second hand, (say 2018) has it got any records of having services done yearly, or any maintenance records at all? Have you had it serviced?
Does it need a regen, has it been chugged around town and needs a good run down the motorway, 25 miles each way at 70 mph, give it a good clear out.

This won't do it any harm, fill up with top grade shell petrol, for the sprint down the motorway, help clean it out.

I expect there's going to be members who say you don't need the top grade stuff, but that's my recommendation. (I don't use supermarket petrol)

[grazuncle2]

My 1.0 TSi idles close to 1000 rpm like my TDi 1.4 did.

I questioned this about the old diesel but was told it was normal.. have not asked about this petrol 1.0.. it does seem high but what do I know.. LOL

[Johntheo1]

Hey guys My Polo 95 TSI has been idling around 950-1000 when warmed up since October ish? I don't remember exactly what it idled at before and I was just wondering if this is normal.? Outside temp is about 8 degrees

I say this because when at a traffic light or so I can really feel vibrations through the pedals/wheels/side handle that I'm not sure if that's normal or not. it's really not heavy vibrations but not unnoticeable either.

Also the engine at idle sounds really rattly ever since I bought it but I've never owned a 3cyl before so I'm not sure if that's what they sound like

sorry this my second car I want to make sure I'm not breaking it cheers lads

My 3 cyl Jan 2018 non turbo idles at 760/780RPM (will check with VCDS for exact figure in a few days) well before full operating temperature is reached, i think I saw a temp of only 30c on the VCDS at these rpm, (it also, I think, goes into closed loop control at 30C) it will maintain this exact speed with main beam, HRS, cabin blower on speed4. Ambient temperature has no effect. 950 to 1000RPOM does seem high IMO.

[ho8882000]

Hey guys My Polo 95 TSI has been idling around 950-1000 when warmed up since October ish? I don't remember exactly what it idled at before and I was just wondering if this is normal.? Outside temp is about 8 degrees

I say this because when at a traffic light or so I can really feel vibrations through the pedals/wheels/side handle that I'm not sure if that's normal or not. it's really not heavy vibrations but not unnoticeable either.

Also the engine at idle sounds really rattly ever since I bought it but I've never owned a 3cyl before so I'm not sure if that's what they sound like

sorry this my second car I want to make sure I'm not breaking it cheers lads

I have a EA211 1.6 MPi naturally aspirated 4 cylinder petrol engine in my Polo, it also idle roughly within the first minute of starting the engine (When coolant temperature is below 18C), this is more noticeable in winter (I am in South Africa, where it is not as cold as UK). But once the coolant is at normal operating temperature (90C), the rough idling shouldn't be happening.

According to the SEAT document - "EA211 AND EA888 FAMILY ENGINES SELF STUDY PROGRAMME No. 161", during idling the EA211 series petrol engine's injection system will inject 3 times when the coolant temperature is below 18C and only 2 times when coolant temperature is above 18C, I guess the initial rough idling we experience comes from the 3 x injection mode (coolant temperature below 18C):

EA211 - Injection.JPG (79.8 KiB) Viewed 3689 times

[6666]

Reading your post, you don't mention if it's a new Polo or a second hand, if second hand, (say 2018) has it got any records of having services done yearly, or any maintenance records at all? Have you had it serviced?
Does it need a regen, has it been chugged around town and needs a good run down the motorway, 25 miles each way at 70 mph, give it a good clear out.

This won't do it any harm, fill up with top grade shell petrol, for the sprint down the motorway, help clean it out.

I expect there's going to be members who say you don't need the top grade stuff, but that's my recommendation. (I don't use supermarket petrol)

Hey cheers for the reply, I'm not sure if mine has a GPF it's a January 2019 model? I bought it in 2020 and only took it on a motorway run in November but since then I've been on the motorway a few times and it should be cleared out. I switched from filling it up at applegreen to a place called campus as the price was 1.74 vs 1.68 per litre but neither give an octane number so I'm not sure if the quality is worse

Edit: forget to mention I bought it used from Hertz in June 2020 I haven't seen any other maintenance documents but I got it serviced myself in March 2021

[6666]

Hey guys My Polo 95 TSI has been idling around 950-1000 when warmed up since October ish? I don't remember exactly what it idled at before and I was just wondering if this is normal.? Outside temp is about 8 degrees

I say this because when at a traffic light or so I can really feel vibrations through the pedals/wheels/side handle that I'm not sure if that's normal or not. it's really not heavy vibrations but not unnoticeable either.

Also the engine at idle sounds really rattly ever since I bought it but I've never owned a 3cyl before so I'm not sure if that's what they sound like

sorry this my second car I want to make sure I'm not breaking it cheers lads

I have a EA211 1.6 MPi naturally aspirated 4 cylinder petrol engine in my Polo, it also idle roughly within the first minute of starting the engine (When coolant temperature is below 18C), this is more noticeable in winter (I am in South Africa, where it is not as cold as UK). But once the coolant is at normal operating temperature (90C), the rough idling shouldn't be happening.

According to the SEAT document - "EA211 AND EA888 FAMILY ENGINES SELF STUDY PROGRAMME No. 161", during idling the EA211 series petrol engine's injection system will inject 3 times when the coolant temperature is below 18C and only 2 times when coolant temperature is above 18C, I guess the initial rough idling we experience comes from the 3 x injection mode (coolant temperature below 18C):

EA211 - Injection.JPG

cold start idle is around 1600rpm but it quickly comes down to 1000, this is more noticeable at traffic lights and stops when the engine is at 90

[ylaw23]

Hi, I am getting high idle revs just below 1500, no dashboard warnings, use lower gears when driving, and consuming a lot of fuel. Garages couldn't find the cause, they have checked the battery, cat converter, and it's not the cold weather, my car was normal last winter. Will have to take it to a VW dealer for a check. 2019 petrol tsi 95 se, low mileage aswell.

[SRGTD]

Hi, I am getting high idle revs just below 1500, no dashboard warnings, use lower gears when driving, and consuming a lot of fuel. Garages couldn't find the cause, they have checked the battery, cat converter, and it's not the cold weather, my car was normal last winter. Will have to take it to a VW dealer for a check. 2019 petrol tsi 95 se, low mileage aswell.

You may be able to save yourself the time and expense of going to the VW dealer as it sounds like your car could have been performing an active / forced petrol particulate filter (GPF) regeneration. Are there any messages under the ‘car settings’ menus accessed via the infotainment screen while your car is displaying high idle / high fuel consumption symptoms? - e.g. ‘engine needs to run longer’ or similar message? Was stop / start inactive? What types of journey do you normally drive? Low mileage could suggest a high proportion of your driving is on mainly short journeys.

If a high proportion of your driving is short journeys when the engine’s not getting up to normal operating temperature, then soot from the normal combustion process of your engine will collect in the GPF as the exhaust temperatures aren’t hot for the soot to be burned off passively. When the soot levels reach a certain level, the car will perform a forced / active GPF regeneration. If you’re driving mainly longer journeys and the engine gets up to optimum operating temperature, then the exhaust temperatures reach a high enough temperature to burn off any soot accumulations in the GPF passively and you’re unlikely to notice the regeneration happening.

There’s a separate discussion thread on GPF regeneration on the forum. From memory, most instances discussed in that thread are in relation to the GTI / GTI+ and typical symptoms of an active / forced regen are some or all of the following;

• increased engine idling speed

• slight lumpiness / hesitancy of the engine when moving off from rest and possibly a slight reluctance to accelerate

• stop / start inactive

• deeper exhaust note

• a burning smell

• significantly worse than normal fuel consumption

I’ve had one (I think) active / forced GPF regen in my GTI+ in the 28 months I’ve owned it and it took around 30 minutes to complete, and during that time, most of the above symptoms were present.

Link to discussion thread; https://www.uk-polos.net/viewtopic.php?t=73177

If the engine is turned off before the regeneration has been completed the car will attempt to complete it during the next ignition cycle. Ideally, the engine shouldn’t be turned off during a GPF regeneration - hence the ‘engine needs to run longer’ (or similar message) under the ‘car settings’ and stop / start function not working. If the engine is turned off before a regeneration has been completed, the car will attempt to complete it during the next ignition cycle. Once the GPF regeneration has been successfully completed, things should be back to normal.

[ylaw23]

Hi, I am getting high idle revs just below 1500, no dashboard warnings, use lower gears when driving, and consuming a lot of fuel. Garages couldn't find the cause, they have checked the battery, cat converter, and it's not the cold weather, my car was normal last winter. Will have to take it to a VW dealer for a check. 2019 petrol tsi 95 se, low mileage aswell.

You may be able to save yourself the time and expense of going to the VW dealer as it sounds like your car could have been performing an active / forced petrol particulate filter (GPF) regeneration. Are there any messages under the ‘car settings’ menus accessed via the infotainment screen while your car is displaying high idle / high fuel consumption symptoms? - e.g. ‘engine needs to run longer’ or similar message? Was stop / start inactive? What types of journey do you normally drive? Low mileage could suggest a high proportion of your driving is on mainly short journeys.

If a high proportion of your driving is short journeys when the engine’s not getting up to normal operating temperature, then soot from the normal combustion process of your engine will collect in the GPF as the exhaust temperatures aren’t hot for the soot to be burned off passively. When the soot levels reach a certain level, the car will perform a forced / active GPF regeneration. If you’re driving mainly longer journeys and the engine gets up to optimum operating temperature, then the exhaust temperatures reach a high enough temperature to burn off any soot accumulations in the GPF passively and you’re unlikely to notice the regeneration happening.

There’s a separate discussion thread on GPF regeneration on the forum. From memory, most instances discussed in that thread are in relation to the GTI / GTI+ and typical symptoms of an active / forced regen are some or all of the following;

• increased engine idling speed

• slight lumpiness / hesitancy of the engine when moving off from rest and possibly a slight reluctance to accelerate

• stop / start inactive

• deeper exhaust note

• a burning smell

• significantly worse than normal fuel consumption

I’ve had one (I think) active / forced GPF regen in my GTI+ in the 28 months I’ve owned it and it took around 30 minutes to complete, and during that time, most of the above symptoms were present.

Link to discussion thread; https://www.uk-polos.net/viewtopic.php?t=73177

If the engine is turned off before the regeneration has been completed the car will attempt to complete it during the next ignition cycle. Ideally, the engine shouldn’t be turned off during a GPF regeneration - hence the ‘engine needs to run longer’ (or similar message) under the ‘car settings’ and stop / start function not working. If the engine is turned off before a regeneration has been completed, the car will attempt to complete it during the next ignition cycle. Once the GPF regeneration has been successfully completed, things should be back to normal.

Thanks for the info but my car is not a GTI. It's been going on for a month now. The symptoms you listed, I only have the high idling speed and fuel consumption. The stop/start system is still active. I drive short journeys around town, but have driven it on the motorway revving to 3k for about 30mins once. In the handbook where it explains about the particulate filter, during a regen, a yellow lamp indicator does not light up. I have checked my dashboard and do not see the symbol at all. Also, just found out my car is still under warranty.

[SRGTD]

Thanks for the info but my car is not a GTI. It's been going on for a month now. The symptoms you listed, I only have the high idling speed and fuel consumption. The stop/start system is still active. I drive short journeys around town, but have driven it on the motorway revving to 3k for about 30mins once. In the handbook where it explains about the particulate filter, during a regen, a yellow lamp indicator does not light up. I have checked my dashboard and do not see the symbol at all. Also, just found out my car is still under warranty.

You’d said in your previous post your car was a 1.0 95ps SE so I was aware it wasn’t a GTI. However, if your car is a 2019 car then it should have a GPF, and based on the information you’d provided (high rpm and poor fuel consumption) it did sound as if a GPF regen could’ve been the reason for the symptoms you described. Based on forum members’ experiences on this and other forums, not all of the possible symptoms I’d listed will necessarily be present when a GPF regen is happening.

Bear in mind it’s not unknown for VW’s literature to contain errors. There was no yellow indicator lamp displayed on my instrument display when the GPF regen was happening in my car - I was aware of it happening because of the existence of most of the symptoms I’ve listed in my previous post; not the existence of an illuminated warning lamp.

Please update this discussion thread for the benefit of other forum members once you’ve had your car checked out by the VW dealer in case anyone else is having - or has in future - the same issue.

Good luck; I hope you get it sorted - and at VW’s expense as your car’s still under warranty .

[6666]

Thanks for the info but my car is not a GTI. It's been going on for a month now. The symptoms you listed, I only have the high idling speed and fuel consumption. The stop/start system is still active. I drive short journeys around town, but have driven it on the motorway revving to 3k for about 30mins once. In the handbook where it explains about the particulate filter, during a regen, a yellow lamp indicator does not light up. I have checked my dashboard and do not see the symbol at all. Also, just found out my car is still under warranty.

You’d said in your previous post your car was a 1.0 95ps SE so I was aware it wasn’t a GTI. However, if your car is a 2019 car then it should have a GPF, and based on the information you’d provided (high rpm and poor fuel consumption) it did sound as if a GPF regen could’ve been the reason for the symptoms you described. Based on forum members’ experiences on this and other forums, not all of the possible symptoms I’d listed will necessarily be present when a GPF regen is happening.

Bear in mind it’s not unknown for VW’s literature to contain errors. There was no yellow indicator lamp displayed on my instrument display when the GPF regen was happening in my car - I was aware of it happening because of the existence of most of the symptoms I’ve listed in my previous post; not the existence of an illuminated warning lamp.

Please update this discussion thread for the benefit of other forum members once you’ve had your car checked out by the VW dealer in case anyone else is having - or has in future - the same issue.

Good luck; I hope you get it sorted - and at VW’s expense as your car’s still under warranty .

Hey very late reply to this but I think my car is going through a forced regen at the moment, same as this guy idling at about 1400 and the gear indicator is telling me to downshift when it said it wouldn't usually (e.g. 3>2 at 40km/h). I'm wondering if it is a regen because although it's idling high I'm not getting any warning lights or status messages in the infotainment and the start/stop is still working. Anything else it could be?

[SRGTD]

Hey very late reply to this but I think my car is going through a forced regen at the moment, same as this guy idling at about 1400 and the gear indicator is telling me to downshift when it said it wouldn't usually (e.g. 3>2 at 40km/h). I'm wondering if it is a regen because although it's idling high I'm not getting any warning lights or status messages in the infotainment and the start/stop is still working. Anything else it could be?

I don’t get any warning lights or status messages in my 2020 Polo GTI+ either during a GPF regeneration. Based on what I’ve read on some other VAG forums (Golf and Seat), it seems that there isn’t a GPF warning light in the instrumentation panel in most (maybe all?) VAG models that illuminates while a regen is happening.

As for stop start still being active - I’m pretty certain it isn’t active during the regen process in my car, although I can’t be 100% certain as I always deactivate stop start when I start the engine. In some Seats, when a GPF regen is in progress, there’s a warning message telling owners to keep the engine running; if the engine is stopped - either switching off the ignition or if stop start kicks in, the GPF regeneration process is interrupted. If this happens, when the engine is next started and gets back up to the required operating temperature, the regen process should recommence. However, frequent interruptions of the GPF regeneration will mean it takes much longer to complete.

Your higher engine idle speed and the behaviour of your gear change indicator does suggest your car is going through a GPF regeneration. Assuming it is, then in your position, I would deactivate stop start until the regen has finished. Your engine idle speed and gear change indicator behaviour should return to normal once the regen is complete.

A forced GPF regen usually takes around 20-30 minutes in my car, and if it’s still in progress when I’m getting to the end of my journey, I’ll extend the journey time / distance if possible so it can complete before I switch the engine off.

[6666]

Hey very late reply to this but I think my car is going through a forced regen at the moment, same as this guy idling at about 1400 and the gear indicator is telling me to downshift when it said it wouldn't usually (e.g. 3>2 at 40km/h). I'm wondering if it is a regen because although it's idling high I'm not getting any warning lights or status messages in the infotainment and the start/stop is still working. Anything else it could be?

I don’t get any warning lights or status messages in my 2020 Polo GTI+ either during a GPF regeneration. Based on what I’ve read on some other VAG forums (Golf and Seat), it seems that there isn’t a GPF warning light in the instrumentation panel in most (maybe all?) VAG models that illuminates while a regen is happening.

As for stop start still being active - I’m pretty certain it isn’t active during the regen process in my car, although I can’t be 100% certain as I always deactivate stop start when I start the engine. In some Seats, when a GPF regen is in progress, there’s a warning message telling owners to keep the engine running; if the engine is stopped - either switching off the ignition or if stop start kicks in, the GPF regeneration process is interrupted. If this happens, when the engine is next started and gets back up to the required operating temperature, the regen process should recommence. However, frequent interruptions of the GPF regeneration will mean it takes much longer to complete.

Your higher engine idle speed and the behaviour of your gear change indicator does suggest your car is going through a GPF regeneration. Assuming it is, then in your position, I would deactivate stop start until the regen has finished. Your engine idle speed and gear change indicator behaviour should return to normal once the regen is complete.

A forced GPF regen usually takes around 20-30 minutes in my car, and if it’s still in progress when I’m getting to the end of my journey, I’ll extend the journey time / distance if possible so it can complete before I switch the engine off.

Just took the car out there for about an hour and still the same after. I didn't take it on a motorway but I was out on 40mph roads.
Think I need to keep it out for longer or time to book it in with VW?