6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Chat about your 6R/6C model Polos here!
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lukafoto
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Drives: A2 Polo 6R conversion !
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6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by lukafoto »

Hi folks

New here but long term VAG car owner and DIYer.

Pretty good with mechanics but could do with some help on the wiring front with latest project. Not technically a Polo but 6R heavily involved!

Bought our second Audi A2 last year (first one owned since 2002 and still going strong with 1/4 million on the clock). What was going to be a simple fix for MoT ended up as a near entire rebuild! New suspension (Bilstein B8 / KAW), all new bushes including Seat Cupra upgraded bushes, New brakes throughout, new sensors, exhaust, etc, etc.

Engine Petrol 1390cc AUA was singing sweetly after cambelt change and cleanup but using oil. Looked into Lupo , Skoda, Seat and A2 BBY options but all are very high mileage these days.

Sourced a 1390cc Polo engine with just 4000 miles on the clock very similar 1390cc CGGB.

Now the fun begins!

See: https://goo.gl/photos/XWjT5DjJyMXFYHGX6

First off - yes it physically fits! But of course old AUA had coil pack into 4 plugs, smaller throttle body, and EGR valve (same as later BBY) for Euro 4 emissions.

Next stage POLO 6R clocks, ECU, Body Control Unit, Engine loom etc.

Also managed to find a main loom (Ibiza 6J)

Question is whether to splice into old A2 loom or go the whole hog and make it a Polo electronically (could be overly expensive if all new sensors required) ?

I have VAGCOM and Audi A2 manual but not 6R or 6J wiring info.

Any help much appreciated!

Best wishes
Penarth Blues
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Drives: 2015 Polo GTI 5 door Black M6

Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Penarth Blues »

I think that the only sensible answer to this is to go back to the Audi engine and get that block professionally rebuilt if possible. In my mind it simply isn't worth trying what you are proposing to do even if you do not value your own time. You'll end up with an horrendous hybrid which no garage will be able to touch if it goes wrong.
Willni
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Drives: Polo '14 6R, Golf 07' Edition 30
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Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Willni »

Penarth Blues wrote: Fri May 26, 2017 10:01 am I think that the only sensible answer to this is to go back to the Audi engine and get that block professionally rebuilt if possible. In my mind it simply isn't worth trying what you are proposing to do even if you do not value your own time. You'll end up with an horrendous hybrid which no garage will be able to touch if it goes wrong.
If he's doing that I don't think he's the kind of person to take it to a garage :P

I'd say if you are going to do it, you'd be best going the whole hog and make it a polo electronically, it'll be easier to diagnose problems for the future since it will be a polo in the a2 shell so should be easier. Plus working with a loom in generally is a ball ache let along trying to merge two like a Dr Frankensteins Monster then you'll have a electrical bugs most likely.

If I were you and was dead set on it, I'd get a polo parts car and just pillage it for parts thus you get all the sensors, loom, clocks etc and should work out cheaper too and what you don't need you sell to help fund it. eg interior
Penarth Blues
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Drives: 2015 Polo GTI 5 door Black M6

Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Penarth Blues »

Willni wrote: Fri May 26, 2017 11:43 am
Penarth Blues wrote: Fri May 26, 2017 10:01 am I think that the only sensible answer to this is to go back to the Audi engine and get that block professionally rebuilt if possible. In my mind it simply isn't worth trying what you are proposing to do even if you do not value your own time. You'll end up with an horrendous hybrid which no garage will be able to touch if it goes wrong.
If he's doing that I don't think he's the kind of person to take it to a garage :P

I'd say if you are going to do it, you'd be best going the whole hog and make it a polo electronically, it'll be easier to diagnose problems for the future since it will be a polo in the a2 shell so should be easier. Plus working with a loom in generally is a ball ache let along trying to merge two like a Dr Frankensteins Monster then you'll have a electrical bugs most likely.

If I were you and was dead set on it, I'd get a polo parts car and just pillage it for parts thus you get all the sensors, loom, clocks etc and should work out cheaper too and what you don't need you sell to help fund it. eg interior
I know - I was just trying to save him s**t loads of aggro down the line :D
Ricmondo
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Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Ricmondo »

I wish, PB you had been around to give me that advice 50 years ago! Had somebody convinced me back in the day I'd now be much richer, have spend fewer long cold nights in the garage, I may even have fewer grey hairs now.

It's so easy to invest a lot of time and money only to end up with a car of dubious value and not as good as either of the originals.

That never stopped me though and I wish our new member the very best of luck and hope he will share the results with us.
Penarth Blues
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Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Penarth Blues »

Ricmondo wrote: Fri May 26, 2017 6:24 pm I wish, PB you had been around to give me that advice 50 years ago! Had somebody convinced me back in the day I'd now be much richer, have spend fewer long cold nights in the garage, I may even have fewer grey hairs now.

It's so easy to invest a lot of time and money only to end up with a car of dubious value and not as good as either of the originals.

That never stopped me though and I wish our new member the very best of luck and hope he will share the results with us.
It didn't stop me either - one abortive BMW 2002 tii attempted rescue and £000's poorer - but a lot wiser now. :D

Just trying to help but I know he's going to want to try and I do wish him the best of luck. If I was going to this effort though, I'd want to do it on a real keeper of a car and I hesitate to say that an A2 is not that, no matter how innovative it was in its time
Ricmondo
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Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Ricmondo »

The price of well kept low mileage original spec A2s is really taking off in the capital. It's only happened this year and oddly most of the customers are architects or designers. Is it a regional thing perhaps, the only architect I know in Penarth has a Volvo fixation, we are none of us perfect and that demonstrates it!
Penarth Blues
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Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Penarth Blues »

Ricmondo wrote: Fri May 26, 2017 8:16 pm The price of well kept low mileage original spec A2s is really taking off in the capital. It's only happened this year and oddly most of the customers are architects or designers. Is it a regional thing perhaps, the only architect I know in Penarth has a Volvo fixation, we are none of us perfect and that demonstrates it!
I think the 'original spec' bit is the important thing here as they may well become a classic given the trend towards small city cars - but a hybrid Polo/A2 will never be that.

I know a few Architects around here, but none into Volvo's - more like XKR's... 8)
Ricmondo
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Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Ricmondo »

Couldn't agree more. Not an originality freak myself but very important in the "classic" market. I had a friend disqualified from a concours because his Model T Ford had nicklel plated trim on the rear light. Previous and subsequent years were nickel, his was in a six month black painted period. All a bit silly if you ask me.
lukafoto
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Joined: Thu May 25, 2017 10:48 am
Drives: A2 Polo 6R conversion !
Location: british isles

Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by lukafoto »

Lots of designers and engineers appreciate the pre SUV Audis. The reason the A2s last so well is they were over engineering and very well packaged in the first place. They were poorly marketed cf other eco cars of the day.

Imported first 1.2 TDI into the UK back in 2002. It's still my daily driver and capable of 100 mpg driven gently after 1/4 million miles. Gets 80+ mpg real world on motorway. Of the 6000 of that rare 1191cc model that were built most are still with their original owners.

With the anti diesel rants going on I bought this petrol machine to do up. Thanks for the advice so far. Where can I get info on wiring colours / body computer connections for the 6R?

Cheers
lukafoto
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Posts: 13
Joined: Thu May 25, 2017 10:48 am
Drives: A2 Polo 6R conversion !
Location: british isles

Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by lukafoto »

OK, managed to hook up engine loom and main loom to the 6R ECU kit.

Can turn the engine over (around 300 rpm) but not firing at the moment - VAGCOM reveals immobiliser engaged (amongst other things - mostly as they are not connected as yet) :


Saturday,03,June,2017,19:06:20:16965
VCDS Version: Release 17.1.3 (x64)
Address 01: Engine
Control Module Part Number: 03C 906 024 CN
Component and/or Version: CGGB MM4HV 8994
Software Coding: 0000071
Work Shop Code: WSC 31414
VCID: 6CD936ED4CC9B22125-5120

Advanced Identification
Serial number:
Identification: MY2-CR1
Revision: --H09---
Date: 31.03.11
Test stand number: 0003
Manufacturer number: 0865
Flash Status
Programming Attempts: 0
Successful Attempts: 0
Programming Status: 00000000
Required Conditions: 00000010
Flash Tool Code: 00000 000 00000
Flash Date: 00.00.00
Misc.
Hardware number: 03C 906 024 BH
Lot Number: 000
Type Lock: 0000
Car Info
Chassis Number: WVWZZZ6RZBU082932
VCDS Info:
VCID: 6CD936ED4CC9B22125-5120
Labels: 03C-906-024-BXW.lbl
Readiness: 06F-907-115-AXX.crd

Saturday,03,June,2017,19:13:36:16965
VCDS Version: Release 17.1.3 (x64) Running on Windows 10 x64
www.Ross-Tech.com

Address 01: Engine Labels: 03C-906-024-BXW.lbl
Control Module Part Number: 03C 906 024 CN HW: 03C 906 024 BH
Component and/or Version: CGGB MM4HV 8994
Software Coding: 0000071
Work Shop Code: WSC 31414 790 31414
VCID: 6CD936ED4CC9B22125-513C
4 Faults Found:

17978 - Engine Start Blocked by Immobilizer
P1570 - 000 -
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 01100000
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 40
Time Indication: 0

Freeze Frame:
Bin. Bits: 00000001
Load: 89.8 %
Lambda: 0.0 %
Speed: 2.0 km/h
Temperature: 20.0°C
Absolute Pres.: 989.4 mbar
RPM: 288 /min

28793 - No Communication with ABS Brake Control Module
U0121 - 000 -
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 01100000
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 40
Time Indication: 0

28823 - No Communications with Airbag Control Module
U0151 - 000 -
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 01100000
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 40
Time Indication: 0

28836 - No Communications with HVAC Control Module (J301)
U0164 - 000 -
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 01100000
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Reset counter: 40
Time Indication: 0


Readiness: 0110 0001


Pics here: https://goo.gl/photos/nHzXvUpbuvV9S7MA9


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lukafoto
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Posts: 13
Joined: Thu May 25, 2017 10:48 am
Drives: A2 Polo 6R conversion !
Location: british isles

Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by lukafoto »

Hi folks,

OK, slow progress this month, too many other commitments but thanks to ciclo for the links and advice:

"Hi lukafoto

1. Look at your inbox. Download the documents (mainly 6R and Amarok - at the end of the documents are the definitions you need). Forget the 6C, is not related with your project.
2. Follow iichel's recommendation. Open a new topic in the forum, to encapsulate all the information there (every step you take).
3. I recommend you (without a doubt) the Elsawin, it is easier to handle than the documents you have downloaded. Also to compare with your A2.

Wow! This wiring adaptation is a huge project. I think you're going to need a lot of help (expert help) to make everything work properly.

I think you should reconsider if this project is worth it."

Just need to find a way to fire up the engine - everything mechanical fits fine.
lukafoto
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Drives: A2 Polo 6R conversion !
Location: british isles

Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by lukafoto »

Ricmondo
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Drives: Polo Blue GT
Location: Teddington

Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Ricmondo »

Well done so far, I admire your tenacity and energy.
Cenick
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Re: 6R into Aluminium Audi A2 !

Post by Cenick »

I realise that this is an old thread resurrection, but have 2 questions;

Did you ever complete this project & do you have a 1.2 still?

Thanks
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