Gearbox swapping

GroovyCarrot · Post by **GroovyCarrot** » Fri Mar 26, 2004 7:38 am

Hi,
I'm looking to replace my polo's 4 speed box with a 5 speed nicked from another polo. However, it's easier for me to get my hands on a MK3 with a 5 speed than another MK2, so I was wondering if there were any technical changes made on the MK3 box and if so should I just hunt a bit harder for a MK2?

Cheers for your help.

madmatt · Post by **madmatt** » Fri Mar 26, 2004 8:50 pm

not sure but i think they will fit but you do know you will need to replace your anti roll bar too as i found out when oil started to poor from the gear box end casing

and you will find out when you undo the nuts at the end of the anti roll bar which secures to the bottom arms you will pull and pull and find that your taking the bush with it

GroovyCarrot · Post by **GroovyCarrot** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 8:46 am

Ah, sounds like fun.. I'll bear that in mind, thanks

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » Wed Mar 31, 2004 8:44 pm

lol your lucky if you have found a five speed box it took me 2 weeks and 112 polos later to find one,

mind you 2 hours later box was replaced and all sorted just make sure you have the little splined keys to take off the drive shaft off the gear box, means you don't have to tound the anti roll bar,

GroovyCarrot · Post by **GroovyCarrot** » Wed Mar 31, 2004 9:30 pm

Hrm.. little splined keys? Any idea what they're actually called so I can work out what they are?

Having taken a closer look, the mk2 gearbox I was looking at is actually 4+e rather than 5 speed, and the mk3's linkage is shot to pieces.. however, I shall keep trying.. there'll be one somewhere

polo2k · Post by **polo2k** » Sun Apr 04, 2004 11:26 am

torx or multi spline (mullti are also called tripple square)

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » Sun Apr 04, 2004 11:30 pm

its actually multi spline not torx, torx have 6 points, splined have about 12 i think.

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Wed Apr 07, 2004 4:44 pm

Whether you take "5 speed" or "4+E" depends on what you want that 5th gear for - is your existing box too wide, or do you want to better the cruising economy? (choose the first or second one correspondingly)

GroovyCarrot · Post by **GroovyCarrot** » Wed Apr 07, 2004 11:42 pm

I've been weighing up which I need more.. I do need as good fuel economy as I can get, however I only rarely do a decent distance at motorway speeds.. I think the standard 5 speed box would be the best compromise really, but a lot harder to source.

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:18 am

oi carrot, if i may be so bold, where were you looking at that 4+e anyway?

(cuz thats what im after

)

really dont fancy having to look thru 112 cars, finding the gearbox code or sticking them in 5th and twirling the wheels to see how many times the cam sproket goes round

Gareth_GT_Hatch · Post by **Gareth_GT_Hatch** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 1:12 pm

Tahrey1043 wrote:oi carrot, if i may be so bold, where were you looking at that 4+e anyway?

(cuz thats what im after )

really dont fancy having to look thru 112 cars, finding the gearbox code or sticking them in 5th and twirling the wheels to see how many times the cam sproket goes round

you would probably find a 4+E gearbox on any deecent spec 1.3 such as a CL, coupe S or ranger. I dont think you can get them on the 1.0 because the 5th gear is very long. Its confusing because some later models have the same gearbox (the 8p one) but it doesnt say E but 5. Your best bet is to source a 1.0L 5 speed box out of a match or something like that. a mk3 box would also fit

bstardchild · Post by **bstardchild** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 11:30 pm

GroovyCarrot wrote:Hi,
I'm looking to replace my polo's 4 speed box with a 5 speed nicked from another polo. However, it's easier for me to get my hands on a MK3 with a 5 speed than another MK2, so I was wondering if there were any technical changes made on the MK3 box and if so should I just hunt a bit harder for a MK2?

Cheers for your help.

I don't want to sound daft here but wouldn't you be better off hunting for a 1.3 with a 5 speed to start with - it seems what you are after is a bit more performance and economy and IMHO you get both with a 1.3 - the engine doesn't have to work so hard and the gearing is a bit more longer so more cc = less fuel

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Mon Apr 26, 2004 2:07 pm

Nah definately up for the long 5th (or I was...).. I reckon it can cope with it easy-as. Not much power in the beast but it gives it up over a beautiful wide area... Should (theoretically) handle the 8P from about 40 on up to 80 for some real comfy cruising.
Not that it seems I can afford it, or that it makes economical sense to do so - any time I get a quote at the moment it seems fifty quid on top of the last one!

A 1.3 fresh from the factory is likely more economical at the higher speeds than a similar 1.0 but it might all be due to the gearing - the makers reckoning on the drivers being lazy sods and not caring for having to gear down on hills or worrying too much about thrashing the small engine on a run

(least thats what the specs suggest to me). The one litre is still more economical around town - requires less fuel to maintain idle, or to punt around at low speeds (as well as being lighter).

Ah well, only a couple more leads to follow up, but it'll be having the clutch done this wednesday so all bets are off after that - unless I feel brave enough to do the job myself, the labour charges for a box swap are just insane for a Â£600-700 car (they're easily more than half the Â£190 charge for the clutch job).

EDIT - actually there's better boxes for the job, such as the AYZ, CEE or CMC.... similar ratio setup but a bigger reduction on the final drive, for about a 20.2mph/1000 top - very very suitable
(came into some fresh data

)

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 5:42 am

groovy if you're interested (or anyone else) i made up a spreadsheet with the data i managed to find on boxes. could be a bit more helpful for those looking to do a swap, to have a proper idea of what the changes entail on hand.

dont forget you'll need a new linkage going from 4 to 5sp (and, as the horror story goes, an ever mounting list of parts.... different drive shafts, engine mountings, flavours of ice cream preferred by your cat.. all things people have told me and i dont know whether to believe)

GroovyCarrot · Post by **GroovyCarrot** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 4:13 pm

My reasoning for sticking a 5 speed in a 1.0 instead of getting a 1.3 to begin with was originally just insurance-orientated, until I actually thought about it and realised that they'd probably whack a good bit onto the premium if I fitted a 5 speed box anyway.. reconsidering doing it now, really.. considering the whole thing's financed off a saturday job in a supermarket, I can't really afford to go adding to the insurance bill

Ah well, anyway, I'll have the engine out in the summer because the piston rings are on their last legs, so I'll reconsider doing it then..

Thanks for all your help everyone, whether I eventually go for it or not

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