In great need of help

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Retali
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In great need of help

Post by Retali »

Hello guys,

I almost never post anything here but i promise you i lurk around to watch the updates from ciclo and others :o

Anyway i have a problem with my 105hp 2010 vw polo tsi (benzin 150k km), for around.... two years. The problem is ESP light going into limp mode.

A boost leak test with manometer has been performed and all (i hope) leakage from hoses or rubber seals has been fixed (During these 2 years there was a boost leak due to broken seals)
Both map sensors have been replaced with oem sensors. Allso that plastic cheap valve (that keeps on breaking and you smell gasoline inside the car) is ok.
The air throttle body has been cleaned more than once.

I have also checked the wastegate with a sticker and it seems to (my unexperienced eye and based on the youtube video) to be moving ok

I will bother you with the most recent obd tests i did and after seemingly the boost test was performed.

So, when i start the car in the morning, after 300 metes and when i turn the wheel of the car the esp lights comes on and off.
I immeditaly obd test the car and the error i get is p1155 (short circuit to b+) i erase the fault code and restart the car.
After around 200-300 meters and again when i turn the wheel the esp comes on and stays on.
After i obd the car the error codes i get is p1155 and p227900(intake air system leak) and 01314 (ECM fault).

Before replacing the map sensors i have check the map plugs with polymeter (1 and 3 pins) and the voltage is 5 so i guess both plugs are working fine (?)

Before performing all these tests myself, they have told me that problem is the wastegate and that it needs to be replaced along with the turbo.Btw the wastegate was upgraded around 2011 from the dealership with that ring.
But an electrician told me that if the problem was due to wastegate i would get a wastegate error code which i am not, is this true ?

If i change the turbo/wastegate it will cost me around 1.500 euro. If i was 100% certain this was the problem i would change it, but then i am afraid that when i pay that kind of money and start the car next thing in the morning the same problem will appear. I am not sure this is the problem but during summer this problem occurs in the morning after the car been parked for around 17 hours , at noon it doesnt. During winter time . Rainy days more often as far as i can remember. This fault appears EVERY morning at the same street corners possibly because there the engines throttle is needed. After 5-6 minutes i switch off the ignition the esp light comes off and i dont get limp mode.

This situation is driving me crazy to the point i want to kick the car out of a cliff but i i have invested so much time and money in it that i cant.
Can anyone help me, suggest some tests etc ?

UPDATE 16/01/2023 :

OK guys .

Second week in a row and the morning problems that USED to occur 5 to 8 items for a single 25 min drive . Never occured again, i consider this problem fixed.

If your ESP light goes on, you switch your car off and the light goes off but after a while it goes on etc. But after some miles/kms it stops poppin on. Have your car scanned.

So if your obd scanner gives "Intake Air System Leak" and P115500 - Manifold abs. press. sens. Short circuit to B+fault and you have concluded that you dont have an air leak (via smoke test or air pressure test) and that your wastegate is normal.
Always check your MAP sensors, if you have replaced them and the problem occurs
then check the map sensor plug . Do this multimeter test : https://workshop-manuals.com/volkswagen ... /page_826/
By doing this test i concluded the 4th wire was problematic.

Thanx for all the help iichel , ciclo and others
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Last edited by Retali on Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:48 am, edited 3 times in total.
VAG-Abound
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Re: In great need of help

Post by VAG-Abound »

What code scanners do you have? Can it log readings to help diagnose what is happening?
Retali
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Re: In great need of help

Post by Retali »

VAG-Abound wrote: Tue Sep 06, 2022 9:50 am What code scanners do you have? Can it log readings to help diagnose what is happening?
i have an obd11

Fault
Control unit: 01 Engine
Active faults: 0
Inactive faults: 2
System description: SIMOS10.20
Software number: 03F906070D
Software version: 9851
Hardware number: 03F906070D
Hardware version: H02
ODX name: EV_ECM12TFS02103F906070D
ODX version: 003015
Faults:
P115500 - Manifold abs. press. sens. Short circuit to B+
Intermittent
Date: 2112-12-23 14:19:08
Mileage: 135026 km
Priority: 2
Malfunction frequency counter: 3
Unlearning counter: 255
Engine speed: 1390.00 1/min
Normed load value: 52.5 %
Vehicle speed: 20 km/h
Coolant temperature: 50 Β°C
Intake air temperature: 25 Β°C
Ambient air pressure: 990 mbar
Voltage terminal 30: 13.913 V
Dynamic environmental data: 209628117D3D11DC3D11D1951536FF
P227900 - Intake Air System Leak
Intermittent
Date: 2112-12-23 14:18:34
Mileage: 135026 km
Priority: 2
Malfunction frequency counter: 1
Unlearning counter: 255
Engine speed: 2448.00 1/min
Normed load value: 46.3 %
Vehicle speed: 35 km/h
Coolant temperature: 40 Β°C
Intake air temperature: 25 Β°C
Ambient air pressure: 990 mbar
Voltage terminal 30: 14.015 V
Dynamic environmental data: 209628117D4D11DC3711D1761536FF


Mileage: 135030 km
Date: 2022-08-28 14:29

---------------------------------------------------------------
Fault
Control unit: 03 Brakes
Active faults: 0
Inactive faults: 2
System description: ESP8.2i front
Software number: 6R0907379R
Software version: 0002
Hardware number: 6R0907379R
Hardware version: H04
Faults:
02214 - Tire pressure warning Lower limit not reached
static
Priority: 0
Frequency counter: 8
Driving cycle: 98
Mileage: 135001 km
01314 - Engine control module (ECM) Please read DTC
Intermittent
Priority: 0
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 138
Mileage: 135026 km


Mileage: 135030 km
Date: 2022-08-28 14:29

---------------------------------------------------------------
Fault
Control unit: 08 Air Conditioning
Active faults: 0
Inactive faults: 1
System description: Climatic
Software number: 6R0820045E
Software version: 0650
Hardware number: 6R0820045E
Hardware version: 24
Faults:
16372 - Control module Faulty
static
Priority: 1
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 255
Mileage: 22048 km


Mileage: 135030 km
Date: 2022-08-28 14:29

---------------------------------------------------------------
Fault
Control unit: 09 Central Electrics
Active faults: 0
Inactive faults: 1
System description: BCM PQ25 H+4
Software number: 6R0937087D
Software version: 0207
Hardware number: 6R0937087D
Hardware version: H46
Serial number: 0147 029100009
Faults:
01758 - Lamps for brake lights Open circuit
Intermittent
Priority: 2
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 135
Mileage: 135001 km


Mileage: 135030 km
Date: 2022-08-28 14:29
VAG-Abound
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Re: In great need of help

Post by VAG-Abound »

It may sound silly but it is easier to start with things that don't need dismantling, etc. Can you park somewhere else and see if the fault triggers after the same amount of driving, or when you make similar turns somewhere else? If it is the turns rather than the time then I'd take a look at wiring in the areas around wheels, steering rack, etc.
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ciclo
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Re: In great need of help

Post by ciclo »

Image

Check that the vacuum hose 1 is 'perfectly' connected in the place shown in the picture.

edit
... and it must not be twisted or bent from its original shape.
Retali
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Re: In great need of help

Post by Retali »

VAG-Abound wrote: Wed Sep 07, 2022 8:38 pm It may sound silly but it is easier to start with things that don't need dismantling, etc. Can you park somewhere else and see if the fault triggers after the same amount of driving, or when you make similar turns somewhere else? If it is the turns rather than the time then I'd take a look at wiring in the areas around wheels, steering rack, etc.
It does not matter if i park the car in a closed garage or not, this fault almost always comes up during the first hundred meters of the day. Usually (according to my experience and obd) happens when i am at low speed around 20-30km and
push the pedal to give some throttle.
Retali
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Re: In great need of help

Post by Retali »

ciclo wrote: Wed Sep 07, 2022 9:53 pm Image

Check that the vacuum hose 1 is 'perfectly' connected in the place shown in the picture.

edit
... and it must not be twisted or bent from its original shape.
I will check this one ciclo ty, i have already checked it myself because it looked really flexible at the time. I will check it again. Thanx a lot for your time.

The short circuit didnt come back again, since i changed the second map sensor. But the air leak code continues to come up.

edit : just checked it. it was in place. i pulled it out for thorough inspection and all i could find is a small crack that seems to be only on the outside.
Nevertheless this crack is a showcase of the hose been too damn old, so ill try to replace it. Do you think it was bad as well ?
Attachments
hose
hose
20220909_091030.jpg (3.39 MiB) Viewed 2058 times
Last edited by Retali on Fri Sep 09, 2022 7:24 am, edited 5 times in total.
amer6R
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Re: In great need of help

Post by amer6R »

Look for air leaks after the MAF sensor, but before throttle body. Inspect for cracked hoses, or badlyplaced clamps
Retali
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Re: In great need of help

Post by Retali »

amer6R wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 7:07 am Look for air leaks after the MAF sensor, but before throttle body. Inspect for cracked hoses, or badlyplaced clamps
I had them 2 months ago run a boost pressure test with gauge (not smoke test) just pressed air into the pipe that goes to the air filter.
The only thing that could find was that the plastic seal of the oil indicator was broken and he told me that since air in the morning is thinner (????? :lol: ) might the air got out of it.
Anyway i changed that aswell but the problem still occurs.
I am afraid of checking all the hoses myself since i have no clue . lol

The vw dealership here told that they need the car for one hour to run tests with it with their scanner prolly for 80 euro then they will tell me about it but i am pretty certain since their reviews are bad
and are a dealership that i need a new turbo aswell. Foot hurts, cut foot etc.

I hoped i lived in abroad and coud find a good tech.
amer6R
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Re: In great need of help

Post by amer6R »

You can slowly spray car starting spray, or brake cleaner or carb cleaner on the hose and listen if the rpms of your engine increase. If they do you have a leak.

I see you posted a picture of the hose, it looks a tiny bit damaged. Try putting tape around it, then go for a spin.

Your DTC faults dont indicate any turbo problems, and if the car pull, no whining sounds and you have no great oil consumption its fine.
Retali
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Re: In great need of help

Post by Retali »

amer6R wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 8:01 am You can slowly spray car starting spray, or brake cleaner or carb cleaner on the hose and listen if the rpms of your engine increase. If they do you have a leak.

I see you posted a picture of the hose, it looks a tiny bit damaged. Try putting tape around it, then go for a spin.

Your DTC faults dont indicate any turbo problems, and if the car pull, no whining sounds and you have no great oil consumption its fine.
ty ill try that aswell
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ciclo
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Re: In great need of help

Post by ciclo »

Retali wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 7:03 am Do you think it was bad as well ?
It's a good idea to replace that hose.👍
It is an important hose because of the PCV valve (the cheap plastic valve you are referring to), ... a malfunction of this valve can ruin your engine.

A clearer image of your hose. (perhaps my computer screen filters prevent me from seeing the sharpest and clearest images).
Image

As info/curiosity:
I remember that in a test that I did (not related to these failures) I did not connect this hose and the engine failures also appeared, but I do not remember if they were the same ones that your diagnosis detects.


---
Retali wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 7:32 am The only thing that could find was that the plastic seal of the oil indicator was broken and he told me that since air in the morning is thinner (????? :lol: ) might the air got out of it.
🤔 ... 😂 ... 🤣
The human being's capacity for invention has no limits... it's fantastic!🤭

---
I don't know what else to tell you, follow amer6R's recommendations until you find and solve this 'little problem'.
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ciclo
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Re: In great need of help

Post by ciclo »

Image

Image

Image
Retali
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Re: In great need of help

Post by Retali »

@ciclo bud, thanx A LOT for everything. I just bought a starting spray and first given chance i will check those tubes and hoses.

I will change the hose aswell as you mentioned.

edit. sprayed the starting spray, nothing noticeable (as far as i have done it correctly that is)

Also @ciclo, one question. On the second image, there is an O-ring (n.21) that needs renewal , where the G71 sensor goes.
Is that o-ring the sensor's one (the green o-ring) or is this something sold completely separate ?
Mine has no o-ring, other than the sensor's one.
Can someone unscrew his sensor and check ?
Also i dled the manual aswell with the 275 pages and cannont find a mention on the other g71 sensor, if it needs an o-ring etc.
Retali
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Re: In great need of help

Post by Retali »

Sadly nothing found so far.
The temperature here is decreasing during nighttime and today's run was really worse and rougher than yesterdays and past days. The esp light popped up 3 times.
When i drive the car around 02.00 pm the car drives fine with no lights popping up.

I will go on friday and run a smoke test with the bosch smt300 in a garage shop. My last attempt to locate an air leak.

I really hope i find something cause if i dont then something weirder is happening.

Edit. Did the smoke test, no leak found.
Guy told me that my last resort is the timing chain that i changed around the same time the problems started occuring.
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