polo 1.4 TDi vs. A3 1.6

logistix · Post by **logistix** » Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:53 pm

hello everyone,
my friend and i had a mini-race at the traffic lights the other day, and surprisingly i took him (at third gear), after going side to side for a while. my ride is a 75 bhp 1.4 TDi polo 9n (1088 kg) and he has the new A3 1.6 102 bhp (1200 kg). i don't know about the torque figures but is this quite possible? or was he not trying his best?

thanks for your help!

carmadaaron · Post by **carmadaaron** » Sat Aug 21, 2004 3:05 pm

Audi A3 (new model) 1.6. 100bhp @ 5600rpm, and 109 (lb ft) @ 3800 rpm. 0-60mph in 11.9 secs. top speed 116mph

Polo 9n 1.4 TDI. 75bhp @ 4000rpm, 144 (lb ft) @ 2200 rpm. 0-60mph in 13.6secs. top speed 106mph

well if u were taking ur mate on from a standing start then i think on paper, he should win.

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Sat Aug 21, 2004 3:28 pm

100hp @5600 (94lbft), 109lbft @3800 = 79hp
typical 2nd to 3rd gear change, 5800 to 3850, keeping around 80 to 100hp all the time
80hp / 1.2 tonnes = 67hp/tonne
100 / 1.2 = 83hp/tonne

75hp @4000 (98lbft), 144lbft @2200 = 60hp
typical gearchange 4200 to 2600, staying around 66 to 75hp
66 / 1.08 = 61hp/tonne
75 / 1.08 = 69hp/tonne

or in other words, your *peak* power in 2nd/3rd per weight would barely beat the "bottom end" of his 3rd gear if he was doing a reasonable high-revs racing change. by rights you should have got your arse kicked

so some other factors at work there.

with traction control, from a red light, and all other things considered, you'd probably have him on a standing start, maybe to near the top of 2nd if both cars had similar gearing.. but then you'd be left for dead.

lots of torque is good for low down grunt, punting about town and not having to change down so often, but in a race the advantage is lost due to the higher gearing a lower-revving diesel needs. speed-wise it's all about the end-result horsepower - torque multiplied by revs (or, divided by gearing).

jtstatic · Post by **jtstatic** » Wed Dec 22, 2004 7:14 am

Well a fact that might make it more even is that standard 1.4 tdi has got dyno results around 80-85bhp.. still on paper it should be weaker though.. I suggest you get it chipped ( should get around 100bhp/250nm) so your friend won't get another chance.

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Wed Dec 22, 2004 5:58 pm

for thems what can't decipher eurospeak, that's a torque increase from 144 to 181lbft

or, 76hp if its at the same revs
so you could well be in with a serious chance there.

(plus your 1.8x torque-to-power rev range vs his 1.47x -- though the modern petrol engines are deceptive with their peak torque as its far more spread out and really should be listed as the range in which you get at least 95%)

/public service announcement

logistix · Post by **logistix** » Sun Dec 26, 2004 2:43 pm

i'm seriously considering superchips for the summer. they claim a 31 bhp and 50nm increase

i think that would make a big difference

Tahrey1043 · Post by **Tahrey1043** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 3:11 am

off a chip, for a sub-100hp engine!!

i think you'd have to hold them to some kind of roller-backed guarantee..

logistix · Post by **logistix** » Wed Dec 29, 2004 6:09 am

Tahrey1043 wrote:off a chip, for a sub-100hp engine!!

i think you'd have to hold them to some kind of roller-backed guarantee..

well, most of the chip applications on tdi engines yield similar results... and also its superchips, shouldn't that make it reliable?

PS: after reading my first post i think i sounded like a boy racer, racing with people at traffic lights

that is not the case, the event in concern here was conducted until the speed limit and in an empty street. so it was just a 0-50 test with my close friend

hope to clear things up

Yetkin

logistix · Post by **logistix** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 11:02 am

finally, i had a chance to put my car on the dyno today. it turns out that she's producing a sweet 91.4 BHP !! the ambient temperature was around 5-6 degrees celsius. this sounds too good to be true, and i will be looking for other dynos to compare with these results. just to let you know guys,

Yetkin

SiDaBa · Post by **SiDaBa** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 11:28 am

Are there any modifications to your engine?

logistix · Post by **logistix** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 11:41 am

no modifications at all. here are some pictures of the process:

SiDaBa · Post by **SiDaBa** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 12:19 pm

Wow that's a really good result then!!

Have to say I really like the look of your car

carmadaaron · Post by **carmadaaron** » Sat Feb 19, 2005 4:01 pm

awesome......!

logistix · Post by **logistix** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 2:34 pm

SiDaBa wrote:Wow that's a really good result then!!

Have to say I really like the look of your car

Thanks! On the background you see some ABT wheels because the place is also an ABT dealer. On paper the ABT chip gives a 20hp increase to the 75hp 1.4 tdi engine, and I was told that if I were to chip, my car would easily reach 110hp. considering this chip business at the moment. any feedback would be greatly appreciated!

jtstatic · Post by **jtstatic** » Tue Mar 08, 2005 7:31 pm

That's very good result from a 1.4... TDI engines usually give better dyno results than factory claims, but usually I've read about 82-85bhp for 1.4 engines without chip. If the air temp was only 5-6celcius that might explain the difference since turbo engines usually benefit from cold air, warmer day the result might be different. Or maybe you just have a good engine

I don't know about 110bhp but with chip you should get at least 100+ bhp, unlikely more than 110bhp with just a chip, though. I've heard about couple of guys that have 120bhp but they usually have modified exhaust and/or bigger injectors. That should be the maximum though since the clutch/transmission can't propably handle the torque if you try higher (with 120bhp you should have approx. 280nm=210lbft).