Oversteer?

[JWC]

Hi
Was just bombing into work this morning, came upto one of those mini white roudabout thinggies. Thought I'm going right, better give it some so get across before that bus. And over I go and then find that for the first time ever I had to librally apply opposite lock to correct the cars oversteer.

My car always understeers, not oversteers. Anyone had this or and theories as to why it did that?

There is no salt down this morning, yet I do see the odd frozen leaf on the grass, I was thinking that maybe there could have been a tiny amount of frost on the white bit (the bit you are not supposed to drive on) Also as I completed my corner, perhaps I closed the throttle quickly and this is what caused the oversteer...?

Luckily there was enough road, and I have driven a powerful (rear engined) VW beetle lots in the past, so its not really a problem, for me.

[ttaw2]

If you lifted off the throttle on the way out it could just be a bit of lift off overstear as the rear unloaded... If you boot it again it'll convert back to understeer - I used to have a 1.2 corsa that you could get to 4 wheel drift doing this on wet grass (untill I ripped my exhaust off!)

I have the same thing on one roundabout on my journey to work - whenever it's slightly damp I can get reliable overstear as i enter the roundabout... I figure it's a combination of road stuface and camber on this particular one that makes it different to all the others...

Wouldn't worry about it though!

[JWC]

Yeah, lift off I think.

I drove a mercedes round donnington inder strict instruction at stupid speeds a couple of years ago, and same thing, lifting off can be as catastrophic as too much power. Didn't think it would happen in the polo with 525 less hp! That said if you're in a slide your in a slide regardless of how much power you have.

[polopowah]

i thought all this oversteer/understeer lark was only associated with high performance machines!
how wrong i was
thats what you get for driving a 1.0
-Ben-

[bstardchild]

i thought all this oversteer/understeer lark was only associated with high performance machines!
how wrong i was
thats what you get for driving a 1.0
-Ben-

The info below should not be tried on public roads........

Understeer is easy even in a 1.0

Push it hard into a corner that tightens - don't lift you'll start running wide no matter how much lock you put on - Thats understeer

Oversteer is much harder in low powered cars and front wheel drive cars but is possible

Push it hard on a corner untill you get understeer (as above) - lift off (sharpish) and or brake and you will induce oversteer - its not funny cos it can get very hairy!

In rear wheel drive cars you can use lift off oversteer to set the car up for power on slides

Damp greasy roads make all of the above easier to start at lower speeds.

My favorite day of the winter is a Sunday when Sat night has seen a nice big snowfall - you can experience all of the above in relative safety on any nice big industrial estate car park and learn an awfull lot about car control on slippery surfaces -

Remember anyone can wheelspin in the snow and ice but to get the car to do ballet tricks without wheelspin takes practice but you will gain a much better feel for what is happening underneath you - it may even save you from an accident one day

JM2pW

[JWC]

yeah, big fan of that. I used to be able to handbrake turn my older cars into a spot within an inch. But with this polo the driver experiance is much less direct. I can still steer with the throttle etc, but it seems less predictable when it does make a departure.

[JWC]

Also, living in brum, last year the entire road system turned to ice. Everyone sliding into everyone. But it was controllable, provided you didn't get out of shape on a slope. As you say, my experiance of zero friction carparks, came in very handy. The trick is to keep moving, avoid any wheel spin at all costs, and keep it straight. And if you must slide into the kerb at the end of your avenue, turn the wheels into it an rid up it, otherwise your wheels come off, as my sister discovered. Or even better - avoid going out, or wait till its freezing really hard - then at least you get [some] grip again, its only the water between your tire and the ice that is slippy.

The long term forecasters are forecasting a very cold winter nothing like the ones we have got used to. Whilst long term forecasting [IMO] is crap, I do feel that people are not ready for it. They try and drive in freezing fog at 80MPH on the motor way. They assume that road salt means they can drive like normal. They make no allowances for reduced visibility, grip, or other peoples reduced visibility.

You can drive on sheet ice, with near zero visibility down the motorway - but you have to pick your way. Pitty you can't do anything about the fool skidding towards your boot at 60MPH sideways.

[bstardchild]

Also, living in brum, last year the entire road system turned to ice. Everyone sliding into everyone. But it was controllable, provided you didn't get out of shape on a slope. As you say, my experiance of zero friction carparks, came in very handy. The trick is to keep moving, avoid any wheel spin at all costs, and keep it straight. And if you must slide into the kerb at the end of your avenue, turn the wheels into it an rid up it, otherwise your wheels come off, as my sister discovered.

My "forces" training on skid pans helped me -

It was a frightening moment (Pre ABS equiped car - actually a 2.3 Cortina MKIV) when the instructor told to drive straight towards a wall at 30mph and then hit the brakes (and keep them hard on till told otherwise) and turn to avoid the wall - as you probably appreciate the car just kept going straight towards the wall and didn't slow down much either!!!.

At what seemed like the very last second he told me to get of the brakes and the car instantly turned to avoid the wall without any impact.....

He actually commented that he initially thought I'd anticipated the command to lift of the brakes as he expected to just lightly scrape the wall and we made no contact at all (judging by the state of the car he'd done the same trick to others many times before with slightly closer calls front bumper was scraped to hell on one side!!!) but reckoned I had a very fast reaction time whatever....

Even with modern ABS the benefit of steering without the application of any brakes is still more effective.

Incindently if it's deep snow I'm driving on disconnecting the ABS is actually advantageous as it reduces the stopping distance - could be starting something there

[JWC]

Yes many people don't understand ABS, they think it reduces the stopping distance. It doesn't. All it does is allow some steering control with your foot planted on the brakes, which is what the average driver does in a panic. However, its not as effective as cadence braking. That said, modern ABS systems are much quicker and respond better than earlier ones that just buzz.

The problem is under hard braking, when I feel the ABS cut in through the pedal (a requirement) it makes me reduce my pressure, yes the best way to use ABS is to just press it as hard as you can and steer around the object. Might work for the average driver, but for me, it goes against what I know.

[polo_mad]

yeah man

[polo_mad]

it al depends